Find answers to Frequently Asked Questions for First Generation Firebirds that have been asked and answered on FGF. Special thanks needs to be given to all the FGF members who took the time to respond to other member's questions.
Body - Hoods
Q: Hood Tach Placement
I just bought an aftermarket hood tach for my Firebird. Now, where to I put it?
A: I’ll give it a try… here goes….All references are as though you are sitting in the drivers seat; therefore “right” means closest to the center of the hood, “front” means closest to the bumper, etc. Aussies, you’re on your own!
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From the left rear corner of the tach to the left edge of the hood is 4.75″
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From the left rear corner of the tach to the rear edge of the hood is 3.75″
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From the right rear corner of the tach to the rear edge of the hood is 2 13/16″ (two and thirteen sixteenths inches)
Ulitmately, I would fudge these numbers a little bit in order to get the tach face square to the axis of the car.
Hole size required in the hood is 3.75″. It is not drilled directly in the middle of the tach space, but is offset in one direction to accommodate the tach housing and wires below. I had a paper detailing this hole as well, but I’ve misplaced it. You’re on your own with that. If I find it, I’ll let the group know…
A: Some good videos:
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Content last modified: January 17, 2014 at 9:17 pm
Q: Hood Tach Placement Variation
Did the hood tachs get place in the same spot over the years.
A: There is a difference between the hole size, mounting holes and location between 1967 (tall style) and ’68-1969 (short style).
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Content last modified: January 17, 2014 at 9:19 pm
Q: Hood Tach Information
What is the story on the hood tach.
A: Just a little background….
The Hood Tach was not exclusively a Dealer Installed Option; Most were factory installed though, I’m sure many dealers did install them as have many enthusiasts over the years. The factory would not have cut a hole just anywhere; there was likely a punch operation for factory hood tachs (an assembly line does not allow for a cutting operation). Sure, you can install one wherever it looks good but if you want it to be correct; get the dim’s from a factory hood with the tach. Also, the factory and dealers used rivets in addition to the nuts (for security).
A: The repor Hood Tach has gone through many revisions since it first came out in the mid-80’s. The most significant thing about the one you can buy today is it’s functionality. It is much better than the original GM Hood Tach (better circuits, lighting) however, as good as it works and looks, it has one obvious thing that distiniguishes it from an original GM tach; the face is plastic and has a sort of ‘fuzzy’ look to it. Not really a big deal unless you’re picky (like me). Those who must have ‘perfection’ can send theirs off (or buy one) from a number of Tach Restorers around the country who offer silk-screening in addition to rebuilding. I’m sure others on the list can elaborate more on the repro tach since all I’ve ever used is original, used, rebuilt or NOS Tachs.
A: The Hood Tach first became available sometime in Feb/Mar of 1967 on all Pontiac Models. The first style was the “TALL” style which refers to the height of the case. Also, the first style used only a single light bulb and there were variations with the face colors and redlines depending on carline and engine.
1967 Firebird (and very early 1968 Firebirds) used the Tall Style. Face background was Black with Green characters while the GTO and Full-Size had Steel Blue Backgrounds with White characters. After supplies of the ‘Tall’ Style Hood Tach were exhausted, the 2nd style came into production. This was a ‘shorter’ case (by an inch or so) and now had (2) bulbs instead of the previous (1). This new style was released into production on April 20th 1967 (even though early 1968 Firebirds continued using the Tall Style). The face on this first ‘short’ style was of a circular pattern. On June 29th 1967, this face was changed to an ‘oval’ pattern.
Face background was steel blue with white characters. The final major design change came with the 1969 model. The face background was changed to black with white characters. The Hood Tach lasted through ’72 production. From 1967 – ’72, there were many Redline variations for different engines/models including the OHC-6 cars and Ram Air engines. The 1967 OHC-6 Firebird had a 6500 redline. This was later changed to 5500. RA II used the OHC-6 5500 redline. All other applications used a 5100 redline. The rarest would be the ‘supposed’ Hood Tach released for the RAV engine. Back in the 80’s, “Purely PMD” from NM built a 1969 Judge with a complete RAV engine and found what was described as the only known RAV Hood Tach that had a lights for ‘shifting’ built into the face.
Anyhow, there’s my ‘long-winded’ reply on Hood Tachs. As with any information, there will always be exceptions to the rule and other variations. I welcome any constructive criticism provided there is some inkling of supporting evidence. What I’ve shared is from various PMD Parts Books, GTO/Firebird restoration guides, articles, and Service Bulletins.
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Content last modified: January 17, 2014 at 9:20 pm
Q: Hood Tach Servicing
Does anyone know a good place I can send my hood tach to be rebuilt?
A: Randy Watson
The Tach Shop
2201 Surry Rd
Jeffersonville, IN 47130
812-284-2555
….Rebuilds, Restores Hood Tachs.
*Not sure if he uses silk screening or decals for the Face.
“The Tach Man”
(South Carolina)
www.tachman.com
*Aprox. $175 to rebuild/restore including silk screening
800-327-8716
NOTE: The repro Hood Tach that is currently on the market has been ‘refined’ over the years but still differs (slightly) in appearance to an original. This difference is in the face (plastic, fuzzy) and the Face Trim. The functionality and lighting is superior to an original Tach. Both Randy Watson and “The Tach Man” can rebuild/restore to appear original but use updated components/circuitry.
A: I agree, Randy is very good at what he does and very knowledgeable about Tach Restoration techniques. I had a price schedule of his services somewhere but I can’t seem to locate it at the moment. From what I remember, these are the basic elements to a restoration……
– CASE… (repair or replace case, face trim, base)
– FACE… (restore, silkscreen, replace faded, rusted faces)
*NOTE: there were some repro ‘adhesive’ faces being sold awhile back. Certainly a cheap alternative to silk screening though, not as ‘concours’.
– CIRCUITS… (repair or replace Printed Circuit and/or components of it)
*By the way, for all you elect. types, these pieces can be purchased cheap at most Electronic supply shops.
– HEAD (or movement)… This is the where the ‘needle’ resides and may require repair or recalibration.
– WIRING… The correct ‘rubber’ Bulb Sockets were also used on certain year tailights. Duplicating a correct harness is not that difficult and much cheaper than buying a repro harness (if you have the correct sockets, connectors which are all easy to find in a junk yard).
Now, if all you want is a Hood Tach and you don’t want to spend over $200, you might be better off with a repro Hood Tach. Internals, Lighting is better than originals and the only major difference is that repro’s have a somewhat ‘translucent’ Plastic Face (letters/numbers seem ‘fuzzy’). Those who must have 100% original/correct appreance.. contact Randy.
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Content last modified: January 17, 2014 at 9:21 pm
Q: Hood Tach Accuracy
I think the hood tachs look great, but are they very factional? Can you read them clearly. Could you very a shift point from 5200 rpm to 5000 rpm? Can you read them that accurately?
A: I’m going to create some more waves and say that I never liked the hood tach for “function ability”. It is not that accurate, hard to read(at least for my poor eyes) and doesn’t have dampener circuitry that most good tachs have.
I have always used the Sun Super tach which I upgraded to a Sun Super tach II in mid 70s when they came out with that. I mount it on the steering column with a band clamp wrapped with rubber tubing to prevent scratching of the steering column. For those of you that are worried about originality the tach has a plug at back to disconnect the wiring harness, which can be tucked up under the dash,while showing the car.
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Content last modified: January 17, 2014 at 9:22 pm
Q: Printed Circuit Boards Repair
Is there a way to repair the printed circuit board? I don’t think it would hold up to any type of heat and it is just a small break in one of the circuits causing the malfunction….
A: I have successfully repaired several printed circuit boards by soldering a small piece of bare stranded copper wire across the break. Use very small rosin core solder and a small tip on a low wattage iron. Remember to clean and tin the wire ends and foil before mating together.
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Content last modified: January 17, 2014 at 9:24 pm
Q: 400 Hoods
Can I put a 1967 400 hoods on a 1968? What type of problems or modifications will I need to make?
A: For all you trivia buffs the difference in 1967 and 68-9 hoods is not the hinges, its in the inner frame and the hood latch. And yes, its important even to a non purist when he replaces his 350 hood and it wont latch, OR if it does latch and then comes open at 60MPH. The 1967 400 hoods had a inner structure that was unique to that model and year only. The 68-9 400 used the same inner structure as all 68-9 flat hoods. I havent tried to put a 1967 400 hood on an OHC-6 but I bet it wont fit. So question again ,whens someone going to repo these in USA?
A: I always look forward to your comments. They agree with my own experiences and usually add to what I know. I just went through installing a nice 1967 400 steel hood on my 1969 bird. The following is what I learned in the process.
*The 1967 400 hoods are unique. They have a different “flatter” hood catch hole (didn’t realize the rest of the substructure was also different and now I know to watch for rust through the scoop holes). The 1967 hood latch is also unique. It does not have the extra safety mechanism (ear on the passenger side) that shoves the safety part of the latch (upper catch) over if the primary catch releases. The secondary safety catch in 1967 relies solely on its spring to shove it into the path of the upcoming hood.
*In 1968 Pontiac changed the catch in the understructure of the hood, it sticks down slightly farther on the drivers side. If you look closely you can figure out that this is required to work with the redesigned (more positive) latch. The new latch has an extra ear sticking out on the passenger side to force the safety catch into place if the primary catch releases. One other thing, the 1968 latch has the same “lever” pull as the 1967. So in summary, in 1968 the catch (which is spot welded into the hood substructure) changed, the hood latch mechanism changed and the pull lever on the hood latch remained the same.
*In 1969 the hood remained the same as 1968, the hood latch also remained the same, and the hood latch pull was changed to a “rod”.
So every year has its differences but all hoods can work for all years and external appearances are the same. However, do not try to cut corners and mix the wrong latch with the wrong hood catch. I know a few horror stories from those who have tried this.
Oh and by the way it took me about 30 minutes with a drill, jig saw, and dremel to make a perfect “factory” hood tach hole. I’m sure the second one would be faster.
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Content last modified: January 7, 2014 at 7:09 pm
Q: Hood Styles for Different Models
I was under the impression there where two hoods the stock hood & the 400 hood. Is this not true?
A: True. 1967, 1968 Firebird had (2) different Hoods. 1969 had (4) Hoods….
1967 Standard (flat) 9788846
1967 “400” (scooped) 9789418
1968-1969 Standard (flat) 9793429
1968-1969 “400” (scooped) 9793430
1969 “400” w/Ram Air 9797763
1969 Trans Am 5460140
*NOTE: Despite the ‘modification’ to the underside of most factory Ram Air Firebirds in 1967 and 1968, there was not a unique “Ram Air” Hood for these years. The modification was done at the Dealership.
The factory 1967-1968 “Ram Air” Firebirds used the standard “400” Hood and actually were shipped with closed Scoop Inserts installed and open Scoop Inserts in the trunk (for dealer to install along with Hood Baffle, Carb. Shroud and seals). So, a ‘functional Ram Air Hood’ for a 1967-1968 Firebird is no different than a regular “400” Hood (except the Scoops are open). Now, for the pursuist, there was a dealer modification required in order to install the Ram Air Hood Baffle. This involved trimming a portion of the under-structure of the Hood along the RH scoop.
The 1969 Firebird (exc. Trans Am) used a slightly different Hood when Ram Air was ordered. This was due to the new Ram Air design (functional, driver controlled scoops). There was a different Hood Baffle for 1969 which combined with a ‘Flap-System’ that allowed the driver to pull a cable-controlled knob under the dash that opened or closed the scoops. The Trans Am Hood though different than the “400” Hood, also used a similar cable-controlled scoop system.
A: I believe you may be mistaken there, that’s another one of those things about the 1969 TA that some sales literature states came with the car. The TA I owned didn’t have any provision at all for driver control of the intake scoops, nor have any others I’ve seen. We’ve most all seen that picture from the accessories brochure of the pull knob and the Ram Air decal on the mounting plate, but I have only seen that on GTO’s. I cannot answer for the 400 Sport Option cars, as I’ve only seen a couple in all the shows and POCI conventions I’ve attended, and don’t remember whether those cars were equipped.
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Content last modified: January 7, 2014 at 7:12 pm
Q: 400 Hood Scoops
I just picked up a 1967 400 hood for $500 — straight, no rust, but has chromed scoop inserts. Question for list: are these an aftermarket item?
A: No. Someone took the scoop inserts and had them chromed. I’ve seen quite a few cars with them painted black as well. This might have been something a dealer may have also done. But they were all originally painted the body color.
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Content last modified: January 7, 2014 at 7:14 pm
Q: Ram Air Hood Pans
I was wondering if anyone has ordered and installed a reproduction Ram Air hood pan and air cleaner from either Ames or Year One for a 1968 Firebird? How was quality and fit? Thanks.
A: …The reporduction ’67/’68 Firebird Ram Air Hood Baffle was orginally from a Barry Martin (Sonic Motors) project about 8 years ago. At the time, he had hired a retired die-maker to reproduce the Baffle with a Kirksite Die. The Die Maker was surprised when Barry said it must have all original ‘Draw-Marks’ because with today’s technology, the ‘draw-marks’ do not occur as they did 30yrs ago. Anyhow, he duplicted all draw marks and stamped out less than a 100 pieces. I believe the original price was $450 and then was reduced later. I do remember going by to see the first batch of Baffles and comparing them to the original that was used as a template. The large hole was cut out using a Laser Cutter. This produced very clean edges. At the time, I couldn’t tell the difference between the two. One note though is that Kirksite material is softer than most production Tool Steel used for dies. It’s cheaper and will only last for 75 or so hits until the sharp definition starts to diminish. The last thing I remember about this project was seeing the Dies sitting on a flat bed trailer (uncovered) about a year later. Who knows how many total pieces were produced (I saw the first 50). Perhaps Year One or someone else popped out a few more. I do know from speaking with several Die makers, showing them the part, that the work required to produce this die would not have been that involved; as with everything, quantity dictates the total investment.
A: Barry Martin (Sonic Motors) did have Kirksite Dies made several years ago for the 1967-1968 Firebird Ram Air Hood Baffle. I believe he worked with Performance Years and they stamped out approx. 75 pieces and retailed them for $375-$450 ea. As for the Lower Ram Air Shroud, I’ve heard rumors of several dealers reproing this piece but have never seen one. Used, these items have been selling for close to what they went for on the recent auction. $400-$500 for the Carb. Shroud and about the same (or more) for the Hood Baffle. Scoops, wellll….. they’re all the same; Closed/Open.. doesn’t matter since the factory Ram Air Scoops were actually regular closed scoops, milled out and repackaged in a Ram Air Part Numbered GM Box. (So, don’t pay big bucks simply because of the ‘Ram Air’ label unless you’re a collector of NOS GM Boxes). If you are able to find an experienced Die Maker/Stamping facility and have the Hood and Carb Pans reproduced AND be able to sell these pieces for $400 a pair, you will have plenty of customers… no problem. Plus, remember the usage here:
Hood Baffle: 1967-1968 Firebird (and 1969 for those non-pursuists) Carb. Shroud: 1967-1968 Firebird, 1968 GTO (and 1969 F, 68-69 non-pursuists)
Thats a big market.
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Content last modified: January 7, 2014 at 7:16 pm
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