First Generation Firebird
Posted By: Bluebird428 Alternator support bracket - 09/14/18 07:22 PM
Did the FGFs have two alternator straps for holding belt tension, one attached to the thermostat housing, or just one attached to the water pump? Manual just shows one I have two. If two is there a special bolt going through the front hole of the housing? Every time I loosen the thermostat housing nut to move the rear support bracket I leak anti freeze. Every other car I've owned that had a bracket attached there had a bolt with a stud above the bolt head so the bracket could be loosened without loosening the housing. Manual shows a special bolt with threads above and below the head but for the rear housing hole.

Attached picture new build coming together 121.jpg
Posted By: ramair68 Re: Alternator support bracket - 09/14/18 07:28 PM
2 brackets, - yours are installed correctly. The bolt on the water pump may not be correct.
Posted By: Ponton Re: Alternator support bracket - 09/15/18 03:40 PM
Thermostat housing does have a special stud which is as you've described. It's frustrating when the original hardware gets tossed and generic bolts used in its place.
Posted By: Bluebird428 Re: Alternator support bracket - 09/15/18 03:46 PM
Thanks guys.
I wonder why the parts manual only shows the front strap?
I have a stud in the thermostat housing now, if I put a nut on then put the rear strap on top it's too high. I'll try a low profile nut if I can find one.
Posted By: HaroldB Re: Alternator support bracket - 09/15/18 05:02 PM
The original had a built on nut on the stud. like this Link
Posted By: BLK69JUDGE Re: Alternator support bracket - 09/15/18 09:40 PM
and
those are all power steering brackets
are you running power steering ....

manual steering only had the single front bracket
a large C shaped ...

looks like a 68 timing cover 1 year only
68-70's balancer
non ac water pump and 68 n newer crank pulley

4" water pump

power steering rear bracket 65 66 ? the bottom half doesnt look 67 n newer ...and 67 68 ? upper adjustment brackets

Scott

oh

and possibly when using the front thermo stud it throws off the adjustment slot at the alternator
I would lean towards the wrong altternator mounting bottom bracket

it all comes back to are you running power steering or not and the alternator mounting bracket thats correct for your needs

to me it looks like your mixing years of parts and manual and power ateering
Posted By: Bronze Bird Re: Alternator support bracket - 09/16/18 12:44 AM
Originally Posted by BLK69JUDGE
and
those are all power steering brackets
are you running power steering ....

manual steering only had the single front bracket
a large C shaped ...

looks like a 68 timing cover 1 year only
68-70's balancer
non ac water pump and 68 n newer crank pulley

4" water pump

power steering rear bracket 65 66 ? the bottom half doesnt look 67 n newer ...and 67 68 ? upper adjustment brackets

Scott

oh

and possibly when using the front thermo stud it throws off the adjustment slot at the alternator
I would lean towards the wrong altternator mounting bottom bracket

it all comes back to are you running power steering or not and the alternator mounting bracket thats correct for your needs

to me it looks like your mixing years of parts and manual and power ateering
.


That sure answers several unasked questions... I’m thinking... parts for sale?
Posted By: Bluebird428 Re: Alternator support bracket - 09/16/18 01:08 AM

Thanks Harold.

Black Judge, Boy, you got all that from looking at an engine on a stand in my garage? Good eyes. Obviously know more about that stuff than I do.
!968 428 block and balancer. Yes, 68 timing cover and water pump, Yes, I have power steering, pump and hoses still in car when this photo taken. No, I do not have AC.
I went through all the numbers I could find on the power steering and alternator brackets when I was trying to find the correct pulleys, as far as I could tell they were for a 68, but who knows? Water pump pulley was from a six cylinder when I bought the car, would have left it on but it wobbled.
I have a washer under the rear strap to make it align more with the front strap, the proper stud without the washer may do the same?
Next time I try to insert washers here and there in order to get the belts to align straight I will ask you for advice. Thank you.

Oh yeah, could also be the aftermarket intake manifold sits on just a little different plane than the stock.
Posted By: Bronze Bird Re: Alternator support bracket - 09/16/18 04:50 PM
Bluebird, I can’t speak to the appropriate pulley diameters, year appropriate balancer, power steering brackets,... but I don’t think anyone really cares...and it wasn’t the question you asked. It’s like when you go to a car show/ cruise night, and the local “expert” feels the need to share his “knowledge” regarding the correctness of your hood tach, or headrests, or steering wheel...or can’t understand why “ no one paints the center exhaust ports”(yes. All are true) Usually, they’ll start telling you that the USED to have a ‘66 Camaro with the original big block 428...a lot of unsolicited BS.


Re your query: My ‘68 has the 2 brackets. However, they don’t line up perfectly anymore because I’m using an E’brock intake which, apparently, is a bit different at that mounting point than the original. They still work just fine. Let me know if you want a photo just to campare.

Posted By: Bluebird428 Re: Alternator support bracket - 09/16/18 05:24 PM
Well I do have the pulleys that are correct, according to the manual on the First Gen Site, someone was kind enough to list. I didn't care if I had the correct numbers for the sake of having the correct numbers, but was having trouble lining everything up so the belts were straight. Black Judge may be correct, the brackets may be from another year/car, but they are also 50 years old and have some wear. A shim/washer here and there is required to get the pulley grooves all on the same plane.
I've had to take the alternator off a few times the last few months chasing down a rough idle snag. Everytime I loosen the thermostat housing nut I get some antifreeze on the lip of the valley pan. I suppose I should have gooped up the housing and gasket, but I like to leave them bare as it's easier to clean up incase the thermostat has to be changed. Do you have the special stud on yours? This hasn't bothered me in the last ten years, but I haven't had to loosen off the housing nut before.

I'm still amazed Black Judge can tell all that from a photograph.

I suppose I should check if someone needs a six cylinder pulley, wasn't the pulley that wobbled but the spacer behind it.
Hmm off topic again.
Posted By: Bronze Bird Re: Alternator support bracket - 09/17/18 12:14 AM
I do not use the “double stud”. It would alter the angle of that rear alternator bracket even more. I’m sure I have one in the various boxes of bolts I have, if you need it.

Re pulleies, I replaced my water pump pulley with one that is a smaller diameter to get more water flow. Seems to have helped. I also had to use a spacer behind it...made a jig on my table saw to cut an aluminum spacer to the proper length. Came out perfectly. Since I also use a spacer on the other side, I super glued the both spacers to the pulley to make installation easier. Got some grade 8 bolts of the proper length, and all is well. It works so well that, even though I have since found the “correct” pulley for this application, I see no need to replace it.
Posted By: Bluebird428 Re: Alternator support bracket - 09/17/18 07:57 PM
The one I had was a smaller diameter also. Most likely put on for the same reason, more flow. After I replaced it was when I discovered the spacer behind was not true and causing the wobble. If I knew that before I took it off I would have just replaced the spacer and left the pulley. Runs cool enough in 110+F with the larger one on so it will stay now.
Posted By: ReverendRW Re: Alternator support bracket - 09/19/18 12:47 PM
Just for a different view, and its not as pretty, but here's my bolt...

Attached picture coolant hub  bracket bolt.JPG
Posted By: Bluebird428 Re: Alternator support bracket - 09/19/18 03:17 PM
good shot of the stud.
That's different, one strap in front of the alternator and one behind.
Posted By: HaroldB Re: Alternator support bracket - 09/19/18 03:26 PM
Originally Posted by ReverendRW
Just for a different view, and its not as pretty, but here's my bolt...


Just FYI - Your two alternator brackets at the alternator should be touching each other and connected to the back of the alternator. Not spread apart and one on the front and one on the back.
Posted By: ReverendRW Re: Alternator support bracket - 09/21/18 01:58 AM
Interesting Harold-- I see what you mean!
THX
Posted By: Bronze Bird Re: Alternator support bracket - 09/21/18 02:08 AM
Reverend, look at your photo closely. Don’t you see the odd angle of the rear bracket at the alternator?
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