1968 400HO I cant find my original post, and being a newbie here, I may not know where to look... anyway, my post said that I wasn't sure what was causing a 4 headlight burnout, assuming that was a rare occurrence, and what I might be facing. But I pulled all four, put 12v across the prongs, and no light. Tested a 12v landscape light and it popped right on. Then volt-metered the sockets with ignition key on, light switch pulled all the way out, and floor switch hi/lo on. Got 12v plus across all four sockets. 4 bad lamps confirmed. Normally that would be a rare thing, but this car hadn't been out of the "barn" since 1982, and many of the filaments around the car have corroded. New lamps solved all. Whew.
'68 400HO Coupe, 4 spd, 259 interior, Windward Blue. My other car's a Johnson 15 outboard on a '61 Starcraft rowboat... Just sayin'.
Cant wait for summer... 68HO4004spvert Sleddog Iowa
God Bless the men and women past and present that have served this country. Thank you. Support D.A.V. - it helps gives a life back to those who gave so much for us.....
Your first post is 3rd down in General. But it came across as being from "FGF Recent Comments" - something I have never seen before.
Anyway -welcome and lucky you.
2012 Mustang Boss 302 #1918, Competition Orange. FGF replacement 2006 Mustang V6 Pony, Vista Blue. Factory ordered. 2019 BMW X3 (Titled to the wife, but I'm always driving it for her. So I'm claiming it) Old projects, gone but not forgotten: 1967 FB 400, original CA car. After 22 years of work, trashed by the guy who was supposed to paint it. I had to sell it. 1980 Turbo Trans Am 1970 Mustang fastback, 351C 4Bbl, auto 1988 Mustang GT, 5 speed 1983 F-150 4x4, built 302 1994 Chevy K2500 HD 4x4, 454 TBI
Never had that occur on my bird, but the exact same thing happened on my F100. Only 2 headlights but they both went out at exactly the same time. I remember troubleshooting the high beam switch and the headlight switch but that wasn't it. Turned out both lights went out at exactly the same time. Hard to believe but it happened just as you described.
That’s nuts. I just had 2 horns go bad ... weird stuff.
Question: Are there replacement bulbs that are any brighter than the original type sealed beam bulbs?... I mean ones you can just plug in without any adapters or electrical mods? I’m getting old and need all the kelp I can get.
I'm a hobbyist. Not a professional. Don't be hatin'!
I have had old headlight bulbs that looked OK when looking at the filaments, but when trying them with a battery, they have burned out in a couple of seconds (the filaments have gone up in smoke, literally). I believe that long time storage had made the bulbs develop a leak, so air has gotten into them. Then, when connecting them to a battery, they immediately burned out. That is my conclusion to why they burned out so fast, but I can be wrong.
Could try the halogen sealed beams, the direct replacement type.
I know you said without any wiring mods but the best way to get more light is to improve the wiring to the sealed beams. Can't remember off hand but seems to me by the time the power traveled from the alternator through the firewall junction block, to the main power distribution at the fuse box, to the headlight switch, to the high-low switch, back through the firewall junction and to the sealed beams my headlights were only getting about 9-1/2 volts. Dullest lights I'd ever tried driving with. After installing headlight relays they get 14.5 volts. The difference is amazing. Easy to do and can be concealed if you're worried about stock appearance.
The operation of a relay itself? I just Googled "How a relay works" and there are a lot of explanations.
If you meant specifically for the headlight system, google 'Madd electrical brighter headlights' has an explanation as to why relays will supply more voltage to the headlights than the fifty year old circuits in our cars. You will need one relay for the high beam and one for the low beam. The relays will be controlled with the existing high low wires from the high low switch. That turns on one or the other relay. There are two circuits that go through a relay, the control circuit (off and on) and the power circuit (from the power source to the component - headlights, fans, ignition, starter, etc). Usually the control circuit is a small wire, low power demand circuit and the power circuit is a heavy wire, larger power demand circuit. The main advantage of a relay is a large wire with a large current is not needed to go from the power supply to the switch and back to the component being powered. A good example is the starter relay/solenoid, It there were not a solenoid on the starter the battery cable would have to be routed all the way to a switch in the dash and all the way back to the starter. We wouldn't want 200 amps going to/from the dash.
The power circuit for the relays can come from the battery, alternator, main splice etc. A good place to draw from is the horn relay most of the first generation Firebirds have the main power up circuit at the horn relay. You can use the remainder of the original headlight wires to power the lights or wire in some heavier wire. I have mine powered from a junction block on the rad support and mounted the relays under the lip if the drivers fender just outboard of the hood. Not completely hidden but not out in the open either.
Understanding is good, asking for an explanation when one doesn't understand is also good. I'm too chicken to start asking about EFI which is why I've never owned a car or truck that didn't have a carburetor. Although I've worked on a lot of aircraft that had mechanical port injection and pressurised carburetors.
I could hardly see the dash instruments at night when I bought my car. I tested the voltage under the dash and it was 10.5-11 volts even though the alternator was putting out 13 plus at idle. I replaced the alternator with one that would maintain 14.5 volts at idle and cleaned up a lot of connectors from the alternator to the ignition switch. Helped, but the headlights were still only getting under 10 volts. I ripped out every wire under the hood and made up my own harness. I got pretty good at soldering by the time I was done. I installed terminal blocks on the firewall and rad support and relays for the starter, ignition, fans, horn and headlights. I also installed fusible links and breakers for circuit protection. I think it's better than it was when it came out of the factory, don't know what I would do if it was an all stock car.
One for high beam one for low beam. If you look at the very bad schematic drawing above you can see how you can cut the original wires coming from the dimmer switch and use those two wires to switch the relays on and off. Then connect the length of the original wires that connect to the headlight to the relay output to power the head lights. I replaced them with new but the originals will work. If you use the horn relay to power the relays put in a fusible link between the horn relay and the headlight relay for circuit protection. You may think a fuse or breaker is a better idea but fusible links will not corrode and cause voltage drop like fuse and breaker connectors do. I put an extra couple of fusible inks at both junction blocks just in case they were needed at some time. It's a good idea to use non-insulated butt connectors, crimp the wires in then solder then cover with heat shrink.
I know it's hard to believe but I found a schematic that's even better than the one I drew,. will attach it with a pic of two relays attached to a horn relay. Not mine.
To answer Bronze Bird on the "new lamps brighter?" question....yes, BUT I ran into a snag. The new lamp's very bright, but I only plugged one into the sockets to check before I mounted them into the bezels and stainless retainer rings. When I started mounting the first one, IT DIDNT FIT. RATS! Firebird Central is looking into it for me, and they seem genuinely concerned. The issue I think is with the tabs on the halogen replacement lamp. They're not in the same place as the original lamps. The diameter is ok, because they fit perfectly in the stainless retainer ring. As you guys know, the slots in the bezel are there to hold the lamp in position, and the stainless ring locks the lamp in place in the bezel. So I bet these lamps wont fit any 67-69 bezel without modification (cut two new tab slots into the bezel), and should be noted that way for others. I think a reason people may not say anything is because they might be modifying their bezel to fit the lamp tabs. That would work it seems, and be fine I guess, but personally rather not do that if I can help it. I have a picture but haven't figured out how to attach it to a post yet...bear with me....
'68 400HO Coupe, 4 spd, 259 interior, Windward Blue. My other car's a Johnson 15 outboard on a '61 Starcraft rowboat... Just sayin'.
i just copied the file onto a file on my computer then off loaded it onto the post. I don't really know how this stuff works, don't even know what a pdf is, I just muddled through it. There are some on this site who know how to off load things from on-line to their computers and who could probably explain it as well. I'm better with a micrometer, dial bore gauge or torque wrench than I am with a computer. I thought my key board was defective as the A isn't at the top left and the Z isn't at the bottom right. That earned me some serious scoffing when I started to complain about the way the keyboard was made. I also get strange looks when I use a slide rule or when fellow gearheads come over to my garage for a beer and see the wall mounted dial phone with the 15 foot curly cord.
Something goofy with those lamps or bezels, I put halogen lamps in my bird and they just fit right in, same shape and design as the old ones. Seems to me three of the six bumps on the lamp line up with the dents in the lamp housing and the other three bumps position lamp centered in the housing.
Bluebird428 Think pdf is "Printable Data File" if you care, which sounds like you don't, nor do you need to.
By the way, your garage sounds like an oasis of relaxation, curly cord and all. I wish the world could follow your lead. Heck, NASA put men on the moon in '69 with slide rules...and nobody was distracted texting pictures of their food. (no offense, anyone...) showing my age maybe.
You wouldn't happen to have any info on the halogens you used would you? Manufacturer/model... I'm wondering if the Sylvania par46 halogen isn't using the same glass casting...(Sylvania sold their auto and resi lamp division to the Chinese in 2016) If you don't, no worries...
'68 400HO Coupe, 4 spd, 259 interior, Windward Blue. My other car's a Johnson 15 outboard on a '61 Starcraft rowboat... Just sayin'.
printable file, thanks. So much to learn so little time.
I'll pull one of mine out and check for you.
Yes they got a man to the moon using slide rules, now they have to hitch a ride to the space station with the Russians. Sigh! Have a TR4 and a challenger r/t six pack bringing their owners over for Beer-Friday this afternoon, you missed the afternoon ferry boat so you will most likely not make it. I love the cars made in the 60s and early 70s. The crap they make now imitating Mustangs, Camaros, and Challengers look like they were made to be driven by cell phones. Gotta like the idea of a turn key 600 HP tire burner with a warranty, but would have to put a paper bag over my head, like the unknown Bengals fans, to drive one.
OK, I got one out. On the front in the glass is - 'SYLVANIA HALOGEN' at the top is '2C1' at the bottom is 'SEALED BEAM' and on the sides is 'USA' and 'DOT' Printed on the back is - ' SYLVANIA USA DOT 12V' 'H5006 110993 0721'
Of the six bumps on the lamp, three are about twice as big as the ones beside them. The higher ones fit into the indentations in the housing. The lower ones ride on the lip of the housing, the rim of the lamp does not fit right down onto the housing. I can see clean marks on the housing where the three short bumps were riding.
I took some pics but neither of the two digital cameras in the house have cords to connect to this Flinstone computer. I have one of those gizmos that looks like a kit-kat bar that one plugs the chip deal from the camera into then plug the kit-kat gizmo into the computer, but the kit-kat gizmo must have given up the ghost because the scanner cannot detect it. Or so it says, I don't trust it. I just took a bunch of photos for a friend in order to get a collector plate for his car. Had to be film not digital. Got my old Cannon F1 out and took some 35 mm shots. Felt good to take real photos for a change. The mechanical sound of the reflex is music compared to the phony sound on the digital ones. Like the electric cars with recordings of real exhaust sound so the drivers think they have a muscle car.
The bumps in the lamp and the dents in the housing are not symmetrical, not evenly spaced. I took out the drivers outer lamp. The notch cut into the inner circle of the housing is horizontal, in the three O clock position. See the beautiful, artistic sketch attached.
Looking at the photograph you posted with the headlamp housing beside the headlamp, if you rotated the housing 90 degrees clockwise I think the lamps would fit into the housing.without modification. Could be wrong.
Thx BB428 That's the lamp I have too! Sylvania H5001 and H5006 (Inner). I cant understand it. If I rotate the lamp 90, I'm afraid the glass refractor lines will be [censored]-eyed and "SYLVANIA" will read level as long as you tilt your head 90 degrees.... The bezels were the originals. I didnt think changing the headlights was going to be a problem!! I was so sure I had a simple fix! Baffled. I'll keep messing with this. Wouldn't be surprised to find out it's something silly I'm not doing right. If so, I'll be sure to update the string. If anyone has any thoughts, lemme know!
'68 400HO Coupe, 4 spd, 259 interior, Windward Blue. My other car's a Johnson 15 outboard on a '61 Starcraft rowboat... Just sayin'.
I meant rotate what you are calling the bezel 90 degrees clockwise. The lamp will then fit into the housing and the housing will fit into the drivers side backing bracket. The housing in that photo looks just like my drivers side housing. I don't know if the passenger side housing is different than the drivers, I will pull my passenger side lamp.
OK, I have my passenger outboard lamp out. The housing (bezel) is different than the one in your photograph. It has the dent on the right side of the housing, part adjacent to the lamp, with the dent in approx position you say to cut yours to fit. Maybe that housing is for the drivers side and you need a passenger side housing.
My drivers side housing looks just like the one in your photo.
I might have them switched, but that shouldnt matter to the lamp though? The tabs in the lamp are in the same place no matter which bezel is used, no? From the driver's seat, left is driver's side right is passenger I thought... (when I took the bezels out to clean and paint, I marked them right and left. but the cleaner removed the markings. I marked them PASS and DRIV. But I did notice they are stamped R1, R2, L1, L2... I guessed right side is passenger...wrong? I hope you're on to something here....I'll check when I get home tonight.
'68 400HO Coupe, 4 spd, 259 interior, Windward Blue. My other car's a Johnson 15 outboard on a '61 Starcraft rowboat... Just sayin'.
OK BLUEBIRD428, YOU WERE RIGHT. (You too, BronzeBird!)
I didn't open all the lamp boxes and try them because I thought I wouldn't be able to return them if they were wrong. I only tried one lamp and one bezel. Happened that I picked a lo-beam lamp and a high beam bezel. Oy Vey.
SO APPARENTLY the high beam lamp ONLY fits the inner bezel and the low beam/running lamp ONLY fits in the outer bezel. The tabs are definitely in slightly different places so that you cant put the hi-beam in the lo-beam postion I guess. Which does make sense.
So, after much head scratching angst, the lamps fit the bezels. Told you I was probably doing something stupid. Sorry Mr. Delorean. My bad.
So last Q's, and we'll kill this string: Which is the right and which is left? Is Driver side the left? And is pos 1 the inner? pos 2 the outer? Wish my marks didn't wash off.
'68 400HO Coupe, 4 spd, 259 interior, Windward Blue. My other car's a Johnson 15 outboard on a '61 Starcraft rowboat... Just sayin'.