Seeing as how more than a few of us have experienced heat soak at one time or another I thought I'd see if anyone has tried using one of those Mylar heat shield wraps? Seems like I'm either going to buy another new starter or find some type of shield or insulator for the starter from the crazy heat my headers put out.
DEI starter heat shield #010235. Been on the car over a year and seems to help. Material rests against header primary tube in my application. I called DEI and they said it wouldn’t be an issue. So far, they were right. I didn’t trust Velcro so a couple stainless steel zip ties were added insurance.
Holy crap, is that ever clean. I don't think I've ever seen an operational engine that spic and span. What engine is that, that has the dipstick going directly into the oil pan?
Sorry Pontiac faithful, I'm running a 461 big block Chevrolet motor.
I was experiencing infrequent, seemingly random starter kickback issues that I couldn't cure. In the end, I think root cause was a combination of a misbehaving MSD ignition and a couple sexy braided bare copper wire ground straps that, when voltage drop tested, proved not to be big enough. I spent a good year trying to solve the problem. Car would function perfectly fine for months then bang, violently kickback when starting. You know, one reaches the point where you'll simply try anything to effect a change. That's where the heat shield came from. Heat clearly wasn't the problem but starter does seem happier wrapped so I retained it.
Thanks for noticing. Fresh build only had ~2500 miles on the clock when photo was taken July '17. Car is only driven on clean, dry roads and I spend a lot of time cleaning... but it is driven. I don't own a trailer. I always wanted to build a nice piece but keeping after the shiny on this one is wearing me out. I'm thinking my next project will either be real patina car or a rat rod - lol something that I can just rinse and repeat.
I know what you mean, I have a friend who just picked up a 1951 Hudson, beautiful original old car. He just puts in gas and drives it, doesn't have to wipe down anything under the hood when he goes out with it.
Ok well I did give the wrap a go. Took it out for a run last weekend and the let sit for 5-10 mins after I got back to make sure it had a chance to get heat soaked and it started fine after. Cycled it like that a couple of times to make sure but it seemed to work. I realize it's just a bandaid though so I'm sending the starter out to be rebuilt anyway. I will be installing the wrap when it comes back new though just to try and extend the life of the starter going ahead. I'm thinking I'll install a bigger ground connection from the subframe to the block. It may not need it but it can't hurt.
Is your hot start problem one that causes the starter to drag when switched on, or one that causes nothing to happen when the switch is at start?
The starter drag problem may be the starter itself, but it also could be the wire, the cables and their connections. As you know, an increase in heat will cause an increase in resistance. Any irregularities in the wiring, the wire/cables them selves, or the connections, will cause a resistance to current flow which is increased many times when the system heats up. When cold the starter cranks fine, when hot the increase in resistance is such the starter will barley turn. You may solve this problem by insuring all the wires and cables are in like new condition and cleaning all connections to reduce resistance to flow. If it's resistance to current flow inside the starter a cleaning or rebuild may be required.
If it's the hot start problem that results in no action at the starter when the key is turned on, that may be due to the resistance in the start wire from the switch down to the solenoid. That circuit starts an the battery and goes through the firewall to the ignition switch, back out through the firewall, through the heat tube and to the starter solenoid. That solenoid draws about 45 amps when cold. When everything heats up, the starter, the wires, and cables all have an increase resistance to current flow and there is sometimes not enough to close the contacts. The purple wire from the firewall junction block to the starter is a lot larger than the other wires in order to carry the high load required to operate the solenoid but heat induced resistance in the wire and the connections is sometimes greater than the system can overcome. Those headers folks like to put on their cars put even more heat into the circuit. That problem can be solve by installing a remote solenoid. The remote solenoid activates with a 2 amp draw and current is supplied to the starter by the large starter cable, with a lot less resistance than the original purple wire from the switch. I put one in my car, even when travelling in 100F temps with the headers putting out so much heat it feels like my shoes are going to melt off my feet, the starter still turns over the 463 cubic inch 10.5 to 1 engine with no problems.
Well we'll see. I sent the starter out for a rebuild. It could possibly be the cable from the trunk is not up to the task but it has been fine until recently so I have to think something changed. Looking at several things that may help. It's a process. I'll be happy if it doesn't leave me stranded anywhere in the meantime.
As far as the remote Sol, if it were the power cable, it seems like that wouldn't change because it's still running to the starter in the same heat as it did with the regular Sol. No?
No. The stock circuit has the purple wire going from the key switch to the starter. When in the on position it closes the solenoid in the starter, which connects the battery cable to the starter motor and pushes the starter drive gear into the bellhousing to mesh with the ring gear. If that purple wire gets too hot and/or has too many dirty, loose or bad connections, which increase the resistance especially when hot, in it's journey from the battery to the firewall, to the switch, back through the firewall, and to the starter, it may have enough resistance in it to not close the 45 amp draw starter solenoid. If your battery is in the trunk the journey is even longer.
With a remote solenoid, the start circuit still starts at the battery and goes to the switch and then out the firewall again, but it doesn't go down past the headers and block to the starter. It goes to the remote solenoid, mounted on the fender or firewall or rad support or.... The small-wire portion of the circuit ends at the remote solenoid where it turns on the remote solenoid which only draws two amps. When the solenoid closes battery voltage goes down the # 4 or #2 cable to the starter. A jumper between the BATT + post on the starter to the S post of the starter energizes the starter. When the key is in the off position there is no 'live' wires or cables downstream of the solenoid.
See the beautifully crafted attached drawings I had made at great costs and sacrifice.
Stock it's not the cable from the battery that engages the solenoid on the starter, but the purple wire from the ignition switch that energizes it. With the remote solenoid it's the cable going to the starter. The cable will carry a lot more juice, even when hot, than the purple wire can and will most likely engage the starter in hot condition.
Thanks for the drawing. It's something to consider for sure. I don't think it's a lack of elect coming thru the ign wire though. I think it's more about my cable from the batt. The lug connector on the end of the cable at the starter is suspect. I'm not sure it's got a good enough clamp onto the wire itself. I'm going to have to find a better lug/clamp. The problem is there's not much room in there.
Got a call back from PowerMaster about my starter. Guy says its toast. Said it looks like maybe it was being cranked a lot without enough voltage coming in. He's going to sell me a new one. Ha! What a guy. Anyway he says minimum 11.5 volts to the lug during cranking. I'll have to check that when I get it back in. He says the blanket/wrap is going to do more damage than good( well there goes that $25 bucks). I should have it by Friday and back on the road Saturday. Maybe it won't be raining.