Trying to decide which way to go with the underlayment. If you are trying to keep the car original, will adding an underlayment like Dynamat Extreme be bad or should I just stick to the orignal material?
I know once the carpet is in, one will never know and the comfort from the Dynamat may be extra nice.
I don't think the Dynamat will hurt anything. It would protect the floor boards better if the carpet ever got wet.
I used to be indecisive. Now I'm not sure. I feel like I am diagonally parked in a parallel universe. 1968 400 convertible (Scarlet) 1976 T/A - 455 LE (No Burt) 1976 T/A New baby, starting full restoration. 1968 350 - 4 speed 'vert - 400 clone (the Beast!) 1968 350 convertible - Wife's car now- 400 clone (Aleutian Blue) (Blue Angel) 2008 Durango - DD 2008 GXP - New one from NH is AWESOME! 2017 Durango Citadel - Modern is nice! HEMI is amazing! 1998 Silverado Z71 - Father-daughter project 1968 400 coupe - R/A clone (Blue Pearl) (sold) 1967 326 convertible - Sold 1980 T/A SE Bandit - Sold
It will also enhance both heat and sound insulation.
2012 Mustang Boss 302 #1918, Competition Orange. FGF replacement 2006 Mustang V6 Pony, Vista Blue. Factory ordered. 2019 BMW X3 (Titled to the wife, but I'm always driving it for her. So I'm claiming it) Old projects, gone but not forgotten: 1967 FB 400, original CA car. After 22 years of work, trashed by the guy who was supposed to paint it. I had to sell it. 1980 Turbo Trans Am 1970 Mustang fastback, 351C 4Bbl, auto 1988 Mustang GT, 5 speed 1983 F-150 4x4, built 302 1994 Chevy K2500 HD 4x4, 454 TBI
4. There is no Best! No best tires. No best engine. No best shock. No best big chrome foot gas pedal. Every car builder and driver is in a different situation. What's good for one might suck for another. The decision on what is "best" for you and your car is completely up to you. As with any decision time, effort, and research is needed by the decision maker - you! Instead of asking what is "best", do some research, explain your situation in excruciating detail, and describe what alternatives you're considering in your decision. Posting a thread with "What's the best..." in the title it is a sure way to get that post tossed into the Tool Shed.
Thermozite: specific R= 1.3 (standard R= 3.7) {http://www.perfectfit.com/15269/154086/Carpet--Padding/Thermozite.html} Price: ~$1/sq.ft. KOOLMAT: standard R=1.65 {http://www.koolmat.com/what.shtml} Price: $14/sq.ft. EZ Cool Insulation: specific R= 1.6 {http://lobucrod.com/} Price: ~$0.68/sq.ft. - I am not so sure about the claimed R-values and the material collapses easily. VB-3 with lead septum: specific R= 1 (standard R = 4) {http://cascadeaudio.com/car_noise_control/car_barriers.htm} Price: ~$17/sq.ft. VB-4 barrier: specific R= 1 (standard R = 4) {http://cascadeaudio.com/car_noise_control/car_barriers.htm} Price: ~$8/sq.ft. These values are in general agreement with the tabulated information for polymers provided in the Wikipedia article. Spray On •Boom Mat (spray-on) – rattle can based spray-on insulation •CoolCar- paint-on ceramic based insulation http://www.coolcarceramic.com/default.htm •eDead (v3) -paint-on latex polymer •eDead (v5) -paint-on ceramic microsphere polymer •LizardSkin – paint-on ceramic based insulation •NoiseKiller – paint-on insulation •QuietCar – paint-on viscoelastic polymer based insulation http://www.metalshield.com/testimonials.html http://www.rhinoshield.net
Roll on •Audio Technix – butyl (possibly asphalt) rubber based insulation with 1 side of aluminum •Boom Mat (Damping Material) – butyl rubber based insulation with 1 side of aluminum •B-Quiet Ultimate (Brown Bread) – butyl rubber based insulation with 1 side of aluminum •CSI Heat Shield – fiber tech padding based insulation with 2 sides of aluminum •Dynamat (Dynamat Xtreme) – butyl rubber based insulation with 1 side of aluminum •eDead (Butyl Mat) – butyl rubber based insulation with 1 side of aluminum •eDead (TekLite) – closed cell neoprene based insulation •EZ Cool Insulation – closed cell neoprene based insulation with 2 sides of aluminum •FatMat – asphalt based insulation with 1 side of aluminum •Hushmat Silencer Megabond – butyl rubber based insulation with 1 side of aluminum •Hushmat ULTRA – visco-elastic polymer (butyl rubber) based insulation with 1 side of aluminum •MegaMat – FatMat or FatMat Mega Mat, asphalt based insulation with 1 side of aluminum •Milla Mat – FatMat, asphalt based insulation with 1 side of aluminum •RAAMmat (RamMat) – butyl rubber based insulation with 1 side of aluminum •Second Skin (Damp Pro) – butyl rubber based insulation with 1 side of aluminum •Second Skin (Luxury Liner) – mass loaded vinyl based insulation •Second Skin (Luxury Liner Pro) – mass loaded vinyl with layer closed cell neoprene •Second Skin (Heat Wave) – natural fiber (better than jute) based insulation with 1 side of aluminum •Second Skin (Overkill) – closed cell neoprene based insulation with 1 side of aluminum •Thermo-Tec Cool-It Mat 146xx series – butyl rubber based insulation with 1 side aluminum •Thermozite – environment friendly (post consumer recycled plastic bottles) based insulation with 1 or 2 sides of aluminum •ZillaMat - asphalt based insulation with 1 side of aluminum (possibly re-branded FatMat)
Closed cell foam is the direction you want to go. like you did not want to spend a lot of $$$, which this stuff can rack up quick.. I found one.. Take a look..
Key words here are "Polyvinyl Chloride Nitrile Butadiene Rubber" aka Vinyl / Nitrile.. Hmm.. Sound familiar?? (www.sounddeadenershowdown.com CCF) and for $18, you can get a 96" x 48" sheet I ordered 1 full and 1 half sheet and for the $29 it cost, did the whole trunk, roof, floor and rear doors with alot to spare.. I ordered the 1/4 inch..
Not sure about volara, neoprene is the same type of rubber used in wet suits, dont think it will suit the purpose well.. I have been searching for Vinyl Nitrile and/or Ensolite type foam (which is what SDS, Overkill, etc are made out of..) and I did not want to pay a fortune for a name..
There are many different grades of MLV and many more of CCF. The lowest grade MLV I'd consider using is sold by soundproofing.org. The variety sold by soundproofcow.com (linked above) really isn't the same thing at all. It has a very course texture and sheds black dust very easily.
When it comes to CCF, there are hundreds or thousands of different compositions and grades. Neoprene tends to have a pretty good combination of durability and compression set characteristics, but again, there are a few different quality grades.
Volara is almost like a slightly squishy Styrofoam. My biggest concern with it is the way it burns. The standard for any of these materials is that it can burn in the presence of a flame, but it should extinguish itself as soon as the flame is removed. It shouldn't drip little flame rockets. Volara burns like crazy.
There's nothing inherently "sound proofy" about Vinyl/Nitrile foams. I prefer them because MLV (vinyl in general) is very difficult to get adhesives to bond to - most tapes and contact adhesives won't hold. By using a CCF with vinyl content you can use vinyl specific adhesives when you need to attach CCF to MLV.
I agree with Rudeboy here, there are hundreds of CCF compositions out there and they vary in quality grades.. I will say, out of the dozen or so samples that I have received in Vinyl/Nitrile (I chose this type as it is what mostly all the sound proofing we us is composed of, i.e. Stinger Overkill, SDS CCF, SS Overkill Pro, Dynaliner, etc..) they MOSTLY look and feel the same for being that mix.
Ensolite is a "type" name that covers many brands.. Kinda like what we would call "chocolate" ice cream. Many vendors make the same thing.
Althought I never thought about the fire burn rates, my thought has always been, if you are using it in the cabin and you have a fire issue, you have bigger problems.. Most of the stuff I put in my car was in the trunk and roof & doors..
As far as MLV, when I get to it, I plan to use that on the floor over the top of Stinger Roadkill (same as damp Pro, dynamat, etc) I feel that MLV between the floor and if possible, the firewall is where one would benefit most.
As far as adhesive goes, need to be careful here. Some adhesives with their chemical compounds will eat right through and melt some vinyls. I have some Weldwood HHR (This stuff gets sprayed on, but can be brushed as well) that was recommended to me and I have to say, this stuff lays waste to any 3M product out there.. Excellent workability and temp resistance as well as bond strength.. I am going to do a test on some CCF I have from SDS too see how it reacts chemical wise, but if successful, I would use this for everything without question.
There is a second mechanism that is similar but completely different Sound has more trouble traveling through layers with very different densities than it does traveling through a homogeneous medium. This used to be presented as a justification for a layer of CCF or similar material. The problem is that this is closely tied to frequency and the layer of 1/8" or 1/4" material is only going to have an impact on very high frequencies. The few inches of space inside the door brings this down into a more useful range.
You have to remember that no matter how good an absorber any material is, thinckness and frequency go hand in hand. You want a material to be 1/4 as thick as the wavelength of the frequencies you are targeting. These numbers will give you something to think about:
1/8" >= 27 kHz 1/4" >= 13.5 kHz 1/2" >= 6.75 kHz
Most road and vehicle noise is in the 50-500 Hz range
CCF is a mechanical not an acoustical material. It's primary use is to keep two other things from making contact with each other. The acoustical difference between 1/2" and 1/4" or 1/8" are going to be negligible. My usual rule of thumb is to use 1/4" where it will be subject to compression - like the floor pans, and 1/8" everywhere else. This will also depend on how compressible the version of foam you are using is. You're really just trying to keep it from flattening out.
2012 Mustang Boss 302 #1918, Competition Orange. FGF replacement 2006 Mustang V6 Pony, Vista Blue. Factory ordered. 2019 BMW X3 (Titled to the wife, but I'm always driving it for her. So I'm claiming it) Old projects, gone but not forgotten: 1967 FB 400, original CA car. After 22 years of work, trashed by the guy who was supposed to paint it. I had to sell it. 1980 Turbo Trans Am 1970 Mustang fastback, 351C 4Bbl, auto 1988 Mustang GT, 5 speed 1983 F-150 4x4, built 302 1994 Chevy K2500 HD 4x4, 454 TBI
Rohrt, I like to call your affliction "analysis paralysis"...I suffer from it at times, but I'm getting much better as time marches on.
Analysis paralysis is when you study much you end up doing nothing for days/weeks/months/years.
The internet, while valueable, is also a great way to fritter away hours of your life worrying about relatively inconsequential stuff. But if it's something you like to do...godspeed good man...sometime I like doing just that, and it's probably the only reason I'm here every so often. Someday maybe I'll get smart and will simply disappear forever like a fart in the breeze...
If you want pure factory, go pure factory. If you want something better, pick something you perceive to be better. If you want 2014 Cadillac quiet, you're in the wrong hobby...sell yer car.
Last I checked judges don't pull up carpets, so Harold, it really makes no difference whatsoever.
"You wouldn't know who has the red(I believe) hardtop 69, has 400 hood and hood tach? Seen it in town there one weekend. Your car?"
Nope, sure don't.
"Rohrt, I like to call your affliction "analysis paralysis"."
Yep that sounds about right.
I was looking for an inepensive option for blocking heat. My floor boards are not in the best shape so I didn't want to use any kind of sticky matt in case I move forward with replacing them some time.
I'am also worried that CCF foams will trap moisture as would jute products.
After all the research what I would like to do it use damplifier pro on the fire wall and one of the companies I think heatsheild products makes a custome firewall insulation matt. I also like the spray on products with the micro sphears. I would spray the floor, inside doors 1/4s and other inside areas that previously had insulation and my tempest had a lot of insulation everywhere.
I found one 1/4 foam that is made with nitrogen that campers use for sleaping mats, that I would also put on the floor over top of the spay stuff.
To finish it off I would use 1/8 foam under the door panels.
I hope you are in a research position for work- if not you should be..
Are you in Cedar Rapids Iowa or where?
Nice job!
Cant wait for summer... 68HO4004spvert Sleddog Iowa
God Bless the men and women past and present that have served this country. Thank you. Support D.A.V. - it helps gives a life back to those who gave so much for us.....
IC. We need to get together, I'd like to see your car. I will PM you with contact info.
Cant wait for summer... 68HO4004spvert Sleddog Iowa
God Bless the men and women past and present that have served this country. Thank you. Support D.A.V. - it helps gives a life back to those who gave so much for us.....
