No insult taken. My daughter says I look like a serial killer. By the way, what did you do about the crud inside the coolant passages? Did you clean it out or are you waiting to get it running for a good flush?

Well that was rather disappointing. I did finally get one cough and a puff of smoke before the battery got to liw to try any more. Oh. Nevermind. I was going to post a quick video to see what you thought.

Oh yeah, took your advise and filled it wuth krud kutter, left it overnight. The came back with a power washer to knock anything loose out, some bottle brushes, the hugh pressure air. Flip it upside down, rinse and repeat till nothing was loose inside

I think maybe I'll take the distributor and plugs out and get the oil primed real good again. Seemed awfully hard to turn over. I guess that means good pressure though. What do you gap your plugs at? I read in the factory book, or maybe it was haynes to set them at .45. Seems big but what do I know?

.035 is factory stock spark plug gap. If you plan on running an electronic system like MSD or Pertronix, you can go up as high as 0.050.

Thanks Dr. I did switch to an electronic ignition so looks like they should be ok then.

The rule of thumb is the higher the compression ratio the smaller the gap. GM was all over the place with plug gaps going as high as .080". The HEI can and will jump that no problem but that gap was for pretty low compression engines. You would be safe around .045". If you are running the engine the way I described be sure the battery is well charged. The HEI needs a lot of voltage but if the battery can crank the engine that is enough for the HEI. Tune up specs

I put the battery back on the charger last night. Just seemed to drain it pretty quick. Like I said, I'll try getting it all lubed up, oil through the pushrods then put the battery on and Tru again.

Did you oil the rings at all? I remember a 400 engine that was super hard to turn over. The rings were dry and caused a lot of friction. It was already in a car so I towed it while popping the clutch. It took a whole block of dragging the tires before it turned and fired. You might try and squirt some motor oil on the rings and see if that helps. Once it fires that will burn right off.

I didn't take them out to get to them but I cleaned and oiled each cylinder wall

No I didn't mean to take the rings out. Oiling the cylinders was good. Just remove the spark plugs and squirt some oil in each cylinder. Crank the engine like that so it gets everywhere. If it cranks easily then there is no problem. If after the plugs are back in it cranks slowly then you either have tremendous compression and/or a weak battery.

Well no luck again tonight. Took plugs off, distributor off, primed the oil pump till all rods were flowing. Spun it over with no plugs in and spun super smooth. Battery is basically brand new and charged all day. Put plugs in and barely wants to turn. Couldn't even get a partial start with starter fluid. Pretty sure the distributor is clocked correctly. Plugs follow firing order. Battery starter and distributor only thing I'm running. Distributor has 10 guage coming offdl battery going to on/off switch then to positive battery terminal. Starter has positive jumper to big lug of solenoid and small wire from s on solenoid to remote trigger the back to starter. Negative grounded to side of starter. Wish I could attach a video so you could see how hard it cranks. Battery has 600 cca.

While researching my problem I found an article that doesn't make since to me. Is this statement right?

A bad ground can also keep you scratching your head. Typically, the distributor grounds itself to the engine when installed. But, if the ground from the engine to the battery is making a good connection, ignition spark will be none existent. To test for a good ground, a jumper wire can be attached to the distributor by connecting it anywhere on the housing and running it to the negative side of the battery.

Shouldn't that be if the ground from the engine to the battery is not making a good connection???

I agree- that sounds stupid. But I will say this- sometimes you need a dedicated ground for the distributor. Otherwise the gasket under the dizzy can impede the grounding. I know, it is supposed to ground through the dizzy body, the cam gear and oil pump shaft. But I have seen it fail to ground enough for the HEI and a dedicated ground wire was needed. A friend was using the Mallory Uni-Lite and kept blowing $100 modules. Testing showed a very poor ground and a ground wire solved it. I also prefer to use real battery cables bolted to the engine. Those jumper clamps are not good enough. Then as for timing I have a system that works great. While the spark plugs are out, run the plug wires to plugs, ground them all to the intake manifold or another good ground. Fresh paint may impede the ground. Hook up timing light to #1. Verify #1 TDC by watching the valves open and close. Spin the motor with no load on it. Watch the timing and set it where it needs to be. By having the plugs out it will spin fast enough to give a good reading but not so fast that the advance kicks in. But you MUST ground the plugs or wires. Otherwise the HEI will short out. Ask me how I know. Anyway this sets your timing accurately without having to actually run the engine.

In that last pic- which terminal are you putting 12 volts to? The one on the right is for that. The one on the left is for the tach.

12v to the one marked batt. Nothing to the tach. I will put dedicated grounds and scrap the jumper cables. I don't have a timing light so the method I uses was to drill out an old spark plug put a long and as wide bolt as the drill bit to make a stop stud and screwed that into #1. Hand crank it until it stops on the bolt. Make a mark. Turn it the other direction until it hits the bolt. Make a second mark. Then the distance between those 2 marks is my too dead center. Does that method work? Then I insert the distributor with the rotor pointing to #1. Then make the the coldest one on the cap the #1 spark plug and wire. Then counter clockwise following the firing order. That sound ok?

IT'S ALIVE
MUUHAHAHA

WELL DONE!!!! I love it, another Pontiac is alive. Any oil smoke? No expensive noises? Yes, that method is great for finding TDC but it does not time the engine. Do you have a vacuum gauge? Some use that to set the timing for the most vacuum at idle. But you really should get a timing light. Snoop around on Fleabay, they are not expensive. Just be sure to get an inductive one. The old ones with the spring on the plug are too easy to get bit. The inductive pickup just clamps around the wire and you stay safe. Timing is OK to be off a little at idle, but at speed, under power, you can really ruin your engine if the timing is not set right.

Thanks buddy. Couldn't have got it fired up without your help. Honestly, I think it pretty much just backfired a couple times. Didn't have it pumping fuel or coolant. Just wanted to make sure we got the no fire figured out. Just a couple capfuls of gas and a shot of starter fluid. I'm going to have to get out the factory book and study up on where the air lines go and all that good stuff. On one of the fires a little 2 inch hose with a screw in the end shot off and hit the ceiling, lol

Yeah, backfires will do that. It blew off a home-made vacuum plug. That is why the timing is so important. Plug up all the vacuum ports for now as vacuum leaks cause backfires too. All you need to use is the vacuum advance port on the distributor and hook it to the ported vacuum port on the carb. I will explain that later. . Don't run it anymore until you beg, borrow, or steal a timing light. Once the base timing is set then you can tune the engine properly. Again, WELL DONE!!!

Vacuum advance of a distributor connected to a ported vacuum source is a retarded Ford thing. Don't do it.
You do not want added vacuum advance when an engine is under load. its getting its mechanical advance depending on rpm and the advance springs.
Vacuum advance is more of an emissions thing. On GM vehicles its used to advance the timing when the engine isn't under any load or in deceleration that's why GM used a manifold vacuum source.
I personally don't even use vacuum advance on any of these cars. just set the initial ignition timing to 15-18 degrees and check the total isn't more than 36 degrees and your good to go.

Bigchief I don't think the OP knows enough about this stuff to stray from the factory settings. He hasn't even timed it yet. High compression engines with big cams normally use manifold vacuum to advance the timing at idle to smooth out the idle. When the throttle is opened the vacuum drops and the timing advance goes away. That prevents detonation. Low compression engines like ported advance because the timing increases with throttle opening and rpm. The low compression and mild cam can tolerate that type of timing advance. Everyone has his own ideas of what works best for their particular engine but for a first timer I would stick to the factory arrangements until they learn more.

Agreed, lol. Did pick up a timing light today. Gonna take carburetor off, clean it up real good, consult the factory book on installing it. Like os&u I'm shooting for standard settings till I get more knowledgeable. But I do appreciate the advice. Never thought I'd be excited to get back to more simple things like body work and paint, lol

Get the timing set first. Everything else is depends on that. The Q-jet is my favorite carb. It has a few quirks but is pretty easy to overhaul as long as you follow the book. Don't force anything!

What's up brotha? Yet another question. So I figured out why it was coughing sputtering and backfiring. Apparently there idea of point the rotor to #1 cylinder and mine were 180° different, lol. Switched that around. Runs and sounds healthy. Problem is after about 10 seconds or so it just takes the [censored] off. Like it was at a drag race. Played with the timing a bit but dies the same thing. The idle screw screwed all the way in doesn't touch the stopper plate. From what I've seen online that has something to do with the choke being fully opened or fully closed. So I tried adjusting what I could but to be honest, we both know I'm as likely to figure it out as a blind squirrel finding a nut. Any suggestions? At least it's starting and running right?

On the starboard side of the carb is the choke mechanism. That old style uses a rod that goes down to the little metal housing on the intake manifold. Inside is a coiled bi-metal spring. When cold, it shuts the choke flap on the carb. As it warms up, it opens the choke. There is a fast idle screw located down low below the choke linkage and it determines how fast the the idle is when the choke is engaged. About 1500 rpm is right. There are two things you can do. One is to unscrew that fast idle screw so the engine barely speeds up at all. The other thing you can do is to fully open the choke and then use a tie wrap or a bit of wire or something to keep it open. That will disable the choke. The whole idea of a choke is to help the engine run better while it is cold. When you first press the gas pedal the accelerator pump squirts gas into the carb. The choke closes to force more gas from the fuel feed circuit. The fast idle screw opens the throttle so it runs faster. But as soon as the engine fires, the choke pull-off [that vacuum can on the front of the carb] cracks the choke flap open a small amount to give more air. Otherwise if the flap stayed closed the engine would over-choke and die. As the engine warms up the coiled spring on the manifold warms and opens the choke flap until it is totally open. The fast idle screw drops down the steps and lets the engine slow down. Once at operating temperature and the flap is completely open then the curb idle screw on the port side determines the idle speed. Since you are running it on a stand I would disable the choke so it just runs slowly. Once it is in the car again I can walk you through getting it all set up correctly.

Sounds good, I will take you up on that. Before I put it back in I have to replace the floor pan on the driver's side and replace/redo some wiring. In your experience would I save much money buying wire and connectors and building the harness myself or with the way everything is mass produced would it be cheaper to just buy a pre-built wire harness? Happy Easter buddy, hope you have a good one.

Happy Easter to you too. I had Grandkids crawling all over the backyard searching for Easter Eggs. Instead of an Easter Ham they wanted fish so I made a huge batch of fried Fluke. No leftovers! I spent the Winter replacing all four footwells. The re-pop stuff is OK but a lot of trimming was involved to make it fit. The front sections assume you are doing under the seats but I did not want to mess with those. There are braces under the footwells too so be careful when you cut the old metal out. I had to drill, screw, and clamp the new metal to the braces to get them tight enough to weld together. I just found my whole car wiring harnesses that I stored after stripping the car many moons go. They seem OK and I will re-use them unless I find problems. Wiring a whole harness would be a huge job. Replacing some small sections would be easy though. Painless Wiring makes the whole car harness for about $550. But it is not plug-n-play, you need to finish it off. I have read on this site about the power top switches burning out so I will be making a whole new dedicated harness for the top. I am using relays back by the top pump actuated by the dash switch. I will run 10 gauge wires from the battery back to the relays. This way all the load is on heavy gauge wiring and the dash switch is low load to the relays. I am working on a six-way power seat base so I will do the same. I will wire it separately from the car so the load is on dedicated heavy gauge wires. I like to use stand-alone marine grade waterproof circuit breakers for systems like that. I run a 10 gauge wire off the battery to a high amp maxi-fuse, then to the breaker. These breakers have an on/off switch so I can disable the circuit at will. This is standard practice on boats and works great for cars too.

Sounds like you've got a solid plan moving forward. Any thoughts on what your going to paint it or dies it need painting? You have me curious about the 6 way power seats, I assume that wasn't even an option back then although I've been wrong before. If they aren't original, are going with something that looks like the original or you just gonna say F it and put in so nice comfortable Cadillac seat? Also was your top always power or did you convert it? Mine was never power top, windows or locks. But I would like to make it a power top. Honestly I'd like to make it a power convertible hardtop but you know what they say, [censored] in one wish in the other.

It was originally Verdoro Green, which I do like a lot. Buy I also like the color of my old hardtop. I think it was called Aleutian Blue. A rare color yet our 1968 Buick LaSabre was the same color. Hard to believe but true. I had two cars that color and have never seen it on anything else. But some rubberhead rattle-canned some black paint on the convertible and it has to go. I totally suck at bodywork and paint but I have a great shop that has done some terrific jobs for us over the years. I have to see if he does convertible tops because mine is original and shot. If he does I may give him the whole job. I hear many horror stories about tops botched by crummy shops. I have never done one but I am always willing to learn new stuff. My top was power but nothing worked. You may want to keep yours manual. I think the power mechanism will all back-fit but don't quote me on that. Ask on here because when I was searching for info I kept getting directed to threads from these guys. The parts are very available but expensive. As for the power seat I do believe it was an option but it is very rare. I like to use the 1991-96 version I scavenge from GM big cars. I am using them in my 1983 G-body, my 2005 Sunfire, I had one in my 1977 Trans Am, and we just got one we will be putting in a friend's 1980 TA. Most if not all GM seats will bolt right on. But oddly, the stock 1968 Firebird buckets do not so you would need a 1968 power base to work with them I guess. I never liked the stock buckets, even with the headrests. I have been saving a set of ultra comfortable Recarro seats I got from a Corvette many moons go. Test fitting revealed the steering wheel will hit my legs getting in and out so that is why I am trying to get the tilt wheel going. The tilt and power seat in my TA was so comfortable I saved them when I cut the car up. Here is the power top in working order: The top works!

Agreed, never liked the bucket seats either. Never heard of Aleutian Blue, but oddly this is what I talked the wife into letting me paint it. (See below). To bad your not closer, I'm actually not a bad body and paint guy. Actually kind of enjoy it. Lol

When it is on the stand I ran the s from the Solenoid to the distributor when I put it back in, the s will go to the purple wire which is connected to the fuse box right? And then before I switched to hei the R on the Solenoid would have gone to the coil which would have gone to the distributor? Right? So now would I just run the R from the Solenoid to the distributor using a 10 ga. Wire? That sounds right but feels wrong, lol

Yeah, that is the color. I really miss it. And I had the teal deluxe interior with a black vinyl top. Very sharp. So on the points distributor the '+' coil wire from the bulkhead connector is the resistor wire. It is 6 volts so the points last longer. It is energized in the 'START and 'RUN' key position. The purple 'S' wire on the starter solenoid is12 volts to enable the starter when the key is in the 'START' position. But there is a yellow wire from the 'R' solenoid terminal also to the '+' coil terminal so that the points get 12 volts IN START ONLY! That is very important. It makes for easier starting but if left at 12 volts the points would burn out fast. So when the 'S' terminal gets 12 volts from the ignition switch the solenoid is doing two things. It is connecting the big red BATT cable to the starter motor. And it is sending 12 volts to the coil for easier starting. But this is all moot because you are using HEI. So you can keep the purple start wire to the 'S' terminal on the solenoid. The yellow 'R' terminal wire is no longer needed. But the 6 volt resistor wire needs to go. HEI will not work on 6 volts. You can cut the resistor wire right at the bulkhead connector and splice in a heavy gauge wire to the '+' terminal on the HEI cap. You can unpin the resistor wire and re-pin a heavy gauge wire [better]. You can run a dedicated 12 volt heavy gauge ignition wire from the ignition switch to the HEI through the firewall [more better]. You can use the ignition resistor wire to activate a relay that will give 12 volts to the HEI [best]. This way you can rig an anti-theft system using the relay. Just use your imagination to rig a hidden kill switch or combination of things that must be in play for the engine to run. I have a way of locking the hood so no one can get in to jump start the engine. You know where the hood latch pull is? See where it passes close to the support bracket? I drill two holes and padlock the pull to the bracket. EZPZ.

Awesome. Ty again

Hey Oly, I was talking with a friend who also has a 1968 convertible. He is more of a grunt mechanic and has no patience. That said, I asked him about his converting from a manual top to a power top. He said that besides the obvious parts like pump, cylinders, hoses, wiring, you need a power top frame or at least the rear parts that connect with the power mechanism. His car has the top frame off and needs everything so he figured why not convert. After dealing with problems trying to find the top frame parts, he is convinced the manual top is easier and simpler to have. The power top parts are very expensive and they also tend to fail at the worst time. [I can vouch for that] He says since manual top parts are practically throw away items, he is going to fix and keep the manual top. Just thought you would like another opinion.

Yup, I appreciate it

Hey bud, I git a question on the aleutian blue metallic paint. Not sure if you know or not. Does it have a base coat that needs to go down first,? I used to have a Cadillac Eldorado that had a mother of pearl base that went on before color.

Nope. Just metallic paint.

I am not sure what system they used in 1968. Pretty sure the choice was either acrylic lacquer or acrylic enamel. The color is the color but the system is how it is applied. Today's high performance paint systems weren't available then. Base coat/clear coat, urethane, water based, epoxy primer, none of these existed back then. So you can get the color in almost any system you want. Application is dependent on equipment and skill level. What a professional shop would use and what you can use in your driveway are two different worlds. Then you have to worry about compatibility. Some paints can be used over the original with no problems. Others are death to each other. Some shops will insist on removing all the original paint and starting from scratch with modern paint. But you said you were good at paint so I assume you know all this. I have a friend with an auto body supply shop. He blends me up whatever color I need. But I suck at paint so I can only use enamel or base coat/clear coat. I re-did my Rally II wheels with enamel in the correct Charcoal Grey and Argent Silver. I painted my Trans Am with what he called 'Fleet White' enamel with a separate hardener/gloss additive. It turned out pretty good but the additive used isocyanate which is very toxic and dangerous to inhale. Modern paint is nothing like it used to be. But check this out: I was searching for the color and even Sherwin-Williams uses it for interior house paint. Aleutian Blue

It was acrylic lacquer. The AMA specs only says "acrylic lacquer". The '68 Sales Manual describes it as; " 'Pontiac's 'Magic Mirror' finish is achieved by a special Thermal reflow painting process, using acrylic lacquers. The result of baking the paint at an extra high temperature, just long enough for the paint to reflow, is an exceptionally smooth surface that retains its 'showroom-new' look far longer than ordinary finishes."

For originality, I used acrylic lacquer to refinish mine years ago. Heating my garage to "an extra high temperature" was not an option so I had to do a lot of buffing to get the look I wanted.