I don't know the rules of this Board but I saved my correspondence with him in case he inevitably denies it. This was no honest mistake. I personally don't think he should be thrown off the Board but should not be allowed to cast his net and sell parts here.
The kits are universal and usually come with an extra spring and those clips. I believe they are to hold the e-brake arm on different applications. Looks good, just make sure the top anchor pin retainer behind the top spring anchor points is on the second shouldered step. it looks ok but hard to tell from the picture. Also the key to that bottom spring that you had on wrong and not have to remember which way it goes is to just make sure there is no contact on the star wheel with any part of the spring. There is something else I forgot to mention that I see quite often which is to check for stuck pistons in the new cyl. before installation. Unfortunately these parts can sit on a shelf for quite a while before they are sold and put into use and you will find one or both pistons stuck in the bore. This happens because the pistons are aluminum and the bore iron/steel and they are assembled dry. if stuck they should be disassembled and you will find built up deposits on the pistons that will need to be removed but do not use sand paper because you will destroy the aluminum/anodized finish. Usually brake fluid and a fingernail will do the job. Take care of the bore also. clean thoroughly with brake fluid when done and assemble with brake fluid and nothing else or you will harm the hydraulic system. This will also help prevent them from sticking during a long dormant period during a restoration. Oops just noticed your e-brake cable is not fully seated in the backing plate.
A few other tips. Make sure and look at the backing plate stops where the shoes ride for wear as it is quite common with high mile old diffs. and will cause problems down the road. Make sure they are flat and if slightly grooved or dished re dress with a file or gently with a grinder. if to deep or actually worn through they will need to be filled/welded and re ground. The other 2 things are for people that are resurrecting old cars and reusing used parts. Make sure and flush the hydraulic system fully with clean fluid before reattaching the line because obviously you don't want any of that sediment and moisture filled fluid being sent through your new parts while bleeding. Make sure you flush the system with new fluid every 5 years or so as brake fluid is hygroscopic and gets moisture laden from all the heating and cooling cycles and this is what rusts and ruins cylinders calipers and master cylinders from the inside. This goes for your newer daily driver vehicles also unless dot 5 fluid, as this will save you a lot of money and down time. If your e-brake cable is good and reusing feed motor oil inside with a needle oiler while hanging and working cable and the cable will last forever.
I did make sure that top anchor see saw thingy was seated as good as it could. I did at first get paint in it and it wasn't seated. The new wheel cylinders i think are fine as i was able to push those pin things in each side of it. The pads you mentioned that the shoes ride against were in good shape and were lightly lubed. The whole brake system was empty and is getting well flushed. That is something I do on all my cars as i found out the hard way how contaminated fluid rots the brake lines.
So now that my rear brakes are done I assembled my axles and installed them. But the new Yukon axle appears to have been made wrong. The back of the wheel studs actually rub against the wheel cylinder.
I thought at first i was going to have to clearance the back side of the studs just a tad but then I installed the other side with the original axle and saw there is a huge difference in clearance. Before you ask I made absolute certain my axle bearings are pressed on all the way to the shoulder on the axle. Also i made sure the bearings were fully seated in the axle housing.
Tried to measure the difference between the new and old axle but is difficult with the bearing and retainer plate in the way but there is somewhere between a quarter and a half inch difference. So now i am screwed.
Strange, is that normal to have that much material on the back side of the stud. I add am used to seeing like an eighth of an inch, that looks like a quarter. What about pressing in new studs.
I think the bearing shoulder on my new axle is machined incorrectly and off at least a quarter inch if not more. This crap only happens to me
I stood my old axle and the new one next to each other and you can with your eye (even my bad eyes) that they are clearly different and causing the hub to sit to far inboard.
Those are the new studs I got from Ames when I got the axle And bearing kit
So a small update. I emailed Ames over the weekend and showed my pictures and no surprise did not hear back from them so I just called. He wanted a measurement and told to use a tape measure from the axle bearing shoulder to the end of the splines.
Any guesses on what I found?
Well the old original axle measures 27 inches and the new one measures 27 and 1/2!
Holy crap a half inch! no wonder its hitting my wheel cylinder. Now waiting to hear back on what they can do about it.
He said he never heard of this happening and I said its because the unheard of crap only happens to me. Seriously when i have car repairs to do its never the common solution its always the bizarre.
If the new axle is 1/2 inch longer than the old one, why isn't it further from the wheel cylinder instead of closer. Maybe I'm not looking at it right.
“Unheard of crap only happens to me.†Man I know how you feel. My wife and I have been saying that for years. And we have a name for it. Because our last name starts with a “P†we call it the “P†Factor. We continue to say.... “it could have been M, N or O†LOL. .
Jim he is measuring from the outside bearing race surface another words as far as the bearing can be pressed on, to the end of the splined end of the shaft. Apparently they machined the bearing surface stop out to far towards the axle face causing the axle to be sucked a 1/2 inch deeper into the diff. At least that's what I can figure out from what has been written.
Frankie at the risk of rubbing salt in the wound, this whole situation could have been avoided almost painlessly in the beginning when you first got the axle. Back in my younger mechanic days One of the first things I was taught when replacing parts was to pull it out of the box and closely compare to the old part even taking measurements if needed. When I shortcutted or just forgot this step it would inevitably almost always bite me in the backside. Believe me when I say you did not want to face your boss because in a repair shop which of course is a business time is money and I had just thrown the shops money and in some cases the part out the window for no good reason. In later years when I ran a shop I would run into this same problem with the revolving door of young trainee mechanics over the years and even some more experienced guys who could never get it through there thick heads. This is not to bash you but to help you and any one else who is dabbling in mechanics with classic cars because even though time in most of our cases is not money for us the aggravation part is much worse.
Well Barnbird the money situation is actually worse then the aggravation although they are almost tied. The thing I read before ordering the axle was to make sure the overall lengths were the same. That was the first thing I checked when I got it The axles are the same overall length. I was unaware that the bearing shoulder dimension could be a potential problem. This was the first Ames has heard of. And yes you are right it could have been avoided.
Speaking of could have been avoided I think I have the wrong drivers side log manifold.
Can you confirm? It is to close to the steering box to get the down-pipe flange lined up. Passenger side fits great.
Stuff happens and you just have to move forward but have resolve that your never going to let this happen to you again. As far as the manifolds you must have missed that I commented in your other thread about them that first gens used a center outlet on the drivers side to avoid just what you are running into. You need to mock the other side also because even though most or all models used a rear outlet they can have different angles and clocked rotations for the flange.
Yes I totally missed your comment about the center port logs. On the bright side I didn;t actually pay for these they were thrown in as a bonus when I bought the pan and valve covers.
The stuff that happens to me I call lessons hard learned and I always try to avoid repeat mistakes. (Provided I remember)
A couple center port logs I found on ebay have 6 bolt holes and mine have 4 is the six ok to use? The current heads have only 4 tapped holes but if I ever get to use my 6x-4 I am not sure if they have 6 or 4 holes i will have to dig them out to check.
Also kind of against your advice I bought a new fuel pump for a few reasons. Do I need to lube anything before installing it? Like the lever and spring? I did read that I need to make sure the lever tip goes under that eccentric cam driven wheel thing but no one mentions lube? Is it all lubed with engine oil during use?
I did just buy a couple used but nice down pipes but that is all I have for exhaust for now. I had hoped to get my logs on then these down pipes and just stick some cheap mufflers on just so I can hear the motor better.
Has anyone actually made a drivers side rear port log work on a first gen? Just curious because it is so close to being ok
First of all as Barnbird stated this could have been all avoided. That said I feel I should get a new guy pass since this axle is supposed to be for my car. Turns out it is a more universal fit and those spacers I tried to get answers on were the solution. Even though Ames did not tell me or zero instructions or warnings or any note of any kind on the box. Also I found no warnings or heads up during my axle selection research before my purchase. Anyway Ames basically said it was my fault and the .500 wide spaced that came with the axle was for that exact purpose. I was suppose to know to press the half inch spacer before I pressed the bearing on.
Ok Barnbird I got my axle bearing spacing resolved. Now I put my brake drums on and see yet another problem I did not know I needed to check before assembly. The original axle hub sticks through the drum enough for the wheel to ride on but the new replacement Ames axle does not. It is basically flush with the drum face and yes it is seated all the way.
Frankie you are just burying yourself. I thought you said lesson learned? This is another thing that is easily seen with the naked eye without even the need to measure. Even if you are to inexperienced to know if something that is different between your old and new parts actually matters you don't just let it go or you are setting yourself up for failure and the why me syndrome. You post here and better yet contact the seller and get a solid answer. Firebirds use a hub and lug centric wheel. rally 2s and some Aftermarket aluminum wheels use lug centric only for our cars. Lug centric can have inherent centering problems with worn lug holes causing vibrations. I am a stock type of guy in my old fart years and that axle would not satisfy me. Now that you have it all pressed together again you will have to contact the seller and see what they have to say, maybe they will say it's fine but for me personally I would have turned away from it as soon as I spotted these things. With good rims it should be fine. Good luck and I wish you the best.
So you are saying its 100 percent my fault? And that Ames was not responsible for selling me the correct axle? All they do all day every day is sell Pontiac parts and I can't depend on them to sell me the right part? Is this what you are saying? My entire reason behind buying from Ames was in the belief their experience would get me the right parts where my lack of Pontiac experience was at risk for situations like this. The boneheads at advance auto down the street have a better track record for getting me the right parts.
Barnbird I literately have some brain damage from the accident that disabled me. I am constantly struggling to do things correctly that i have never done before but with my damage I have like a tunnel vision and have to totally focus on one task at a time. Unfortunately this results in more injuries and screw ups. I joined this forum for advice and support so that I can in fact restore this car. I know I need this help now and it is hard to ask for because I like doing everything myself. I guess I should seriously consider selling all my Pontiac stuff and go back to my familiar Chevy's
We all need help at times That is why I am trying to give you straight talk. I think you are right though and I've veered off course trying to help you understand when I should be just answering the basic question that was asked. It will happen no more.
So you are saying its 100 percent my fault? And that Ames was not responsible for selling me the correct axle? All they do all day every day is sell Pontiac parts and I can't depend on them to sell me the right part? Is this what you are saying? My entire reason behind buying from Ames was in the belief their experience would get me the right parts where my lack of Pontiac experience was at risk for situations like this. The boneheads at advance auto down the street have a better track record for getting me the right parts.
Barnbird I literately have some brain damage from the accident that disabled me. I am constantly struggling to do things correctly that i have never done before but with my damage I have like a tunnel vision and have to totally focus on one task at a time. Unfortunately this results in more injuries and screw ups. I joined this forum for advice and support so that I can in fact restore this car. I know I need this help now and it is hard to ask for because I like doing everything myself. I guess I should seriously consider selling all my Pontiac stuff and go back to my familiar Chevy's
If you're more familiar with chevy, keep your firebird and just install a chevy drivetrain.
I could do that duff but I don't have any Chevy drive-trains I could use. Also if I did that then I would be to tempted to make it into my long lost Camaro. We all know I should not do that.
Just posting some information I came across while looking at other aftermarket axles. Where Ames did not provide this valuable information I noticed that this axle from summit does.
Summit Racing Part Number: SPZ-35060
This axle comes with 2 spacers to accommodate multiple axle bearing options. The spacer needs to be installed before the bearing is pressed on: The thin spacer 1/2 in. is used with sealed RW507CR bearings, and the thick spacer .826 in. is used with set 9 bearings.
Also this axle looks in the picture that it would protrude past the drum face for stock wheels to ride on.
It would've been helpful, and it should be in the AMES parts description, but it wasn't, anymore, a guy building an old car HAS to double check everything when he orders and after he receives the parts. I do tons of research before I order anything, and I still run into a lot of ill fitting or poorly made pieces, just mark it as a lesson learned and focus on the next task. A 67-69 firebird is a lot better looking car ( says me) than a camaro, and I wouldn't have any issues installing a built sbc into one.
I hear you Duff but since I have two Pontiac motors and no SBC then it would cost me more to that and since I am poor that is not an option but thanks for the suggestion
Adam from Ames called me today despite my request to speak to the owner. Adam claims these Firebirds are lug centric and not hub centric making my concern about the hub hat being flush with the drum face a none issue to them. I might just buy a used axle and try to sell this new one. whether its really OK doesn't matter to me as much as I hate the way it looks. I am going to avoid doing business with Ames
Kevin one of the Ames owners just gave me a courtesy call. He was very nice and understanding. He did say they have been selling this axle for ten years with no issues. He said the Firebirds are lug centric only and the hub hat protrusion makes no difference. Even the factory hub hats are tapered so it doesn't matter what wheel you run it would never be hub centric. He wasn't to happy my spacer question never got answered and that i never got my promised call back. He was very understanding on my spacer issue and agreed there should be note in the box of every axle sold and is working to do that Also he offered to refund my second bearing cost I just had to buy from Adam.I told him he has gained back my future business.
Cant wait for summer... 68HO4004spvert Sleddog Iowa
God Bless the men and women past and present that have served this country. Thank you. Support D.A.V. - it helps gives a life back to those who gave so much for us.....
So I have been tidying a few odds and ends like some wiring, Put the diff cover back on and filled with gear oil and posi additive. Replaced all the brake hard lines and finally have a pedal. Filled the motor back up with oil and zinc additive and pulled the coil wire to crank it over to let the oil circulate. Then I put the coil wire back on and sprayed some carb cleaner in the primary's (there is no fuel tank). Turned the ignition key (which did not work before redoing some wiring) and holy crap it fired up until the carb cleaner ran out. Don't want to run it to long anyways in my garage under the house and smoke out and piss off the wife. But i am very excited. Oh yeh I also dumped the rotted headers for stock logs and also now have the first section of down pipes. Last year when I ran the motor it was super smoky and with no floors it sucked just to try to yard drive (not to mention zero brakes). The down-pipe ends right at my seat base so I probably will need another section of pipe to keep the fumes away from my face. Next chance I get I will roll it outside and fill my gas jug and see if it will run and idle etc then I need to check my float levels. Once it runs and moves on its own power It will get parked outside and then I have to drag the other 68 Shell inside and begin actual restoration work. Before anyone asks yes I did all this work on my parts car just so I can move it around my yard. I am so done pushing and dragging this car. Plus now I can get better feel on the health of the motor (or the sickness of it) And test anything else I want to transfer onto the shell project. And I will also be able to run the 350 with straight pipes periodically for motivation. I have an annoying loud neighbor I would get satisfaction by throwing some Pontiac v8 noise back at him.
Wow, you got some things to do dude- get busy! ANd I would like to hear your neighbors response when you ge tto throw the Poncho noise his way , he he he
Cant wait for summer... 68HO4004spvert Sleddog Iowa
God Bless the men and women past and present that have served this country. Thank you. Support D.A.V. - it helps gives a life back to those who gave so much for us.....
So today i put some gas in my little jug to feed the carb. Goal was to set the float levels. I Got the car to run but was having a hard time tweaking the external float level adjustment. I think there is something wrong there but its probably me.The secondary lock screw won't stop leaking and..........I discovered why my motor was full of fuel. With the motor off I could hear something running. Turns out fuel was gushing into the carb even with the fuel line disconnected! Tried for a while to set the primary float but the carb has more issues then i can count. It leaks externally, and pours internally. I was considering trying to rebuild it. (no i never did a Holley 4 barrel). I am leaning towards trying my first quadrajet.
Also a very strange thing happened. I had the motor running and turned the key off, nothing happened it kept running. Then disconnect neg batt cable and it still ran. Then disconnected the pos cable as well and it still ran! How is this possible? Doesn't the ignition need 12 volts? I finally had to choke out the carb to make it shut off. It was not dieseling either it was running not terrible. At this point I fumed out the basement but no co2 alarms. Done until I can resolve this carb and or replace it, Is it me or does the quadrajet look much simpler then a Holley to rebuild?
On the bright side even though i have straight pipes the log manifolds have quieted things down enough i can hear the motor better and so far no knocks or bad noises but keeping my fingers crossed.