So I'm trying to resurrect a solid '68 F-bird that's been in storage for well over a decade. From all I can tell, things have been poorly done by the previous owner.... And the water pump is proving no different.
I pulled the water pump and discovered some real voodoo; all sorts of chunky and gooey junk, poor gaskets, etc. Hopefully you can see some of this in my attached photos.
I have several questions:
Does the 350 have the two rubber gaskets/sleeves at the lower corners of the water pump? There were none on this car.
Does that water pump/timing cover separator plate need to fit closely to the opening of the timing cover? You can see mine has some large gaps in the passenger side. I'm guessing that's not acceptable either.
At this point I'm very anxious about being able to salvage the engine at all. A full-blown removal seems almost imminent at this point, but gosh - if I can flush this stuff out and get the right water pump setup, she ought to make a decent driver.
Compression all measured consistent (on the low side, but consistent), with no weird noises... So my fingers are crossed that perhaps there's still hope for this one.
I'll get this water pump business straightened out and try to make a good decision from there.
What do you guys think? Do I need those water pump sleeves and a new timing cover/water pump separation plate?
Yes you need those sleeves and rubber seals to seal the divider plate so water is pumped thru the block. Make sure you have tight clearance between water pump impellers and divider plate 1/16". i would try and flush out the block before putting a water pump on. looks like alot of gunk in there.
X2 what bigchief said. Maybe use the old pump to run some cleaner through the system. In really bad systems like that I use Cascade dishwashing detergent to get the crud out. But it attacks aluminum so you can't let it sit in there for too long a time. Then flush, flush, flush before putting a new pump on.
Definitely one of the nastiest I've ever seen. Terrible.
I've got the car on jack stands at the moment, but I'll get her back on the ground and shuffled over to a spot where I can really hit that cooling system with some water. Hopefully flush out some of the crud.
The oil pan had some coolant mixed in with the oil; could any of that cross contamination have happened right here? Where this water pump/timing cover meet? Any chance I'll find something that's rusted behind those separator plates that would have allowed coolant to find an oil jacket?
Or should I just assume the worst: cracked block/head?
I was aiming to attempt the new water pump and gaskets just to verify any potential options before going straight to an engine removal..... You think I'm on the right track?
The aluminum timing covers corrode and get holes in them. That's how water gets into the oil. Best bet is to just change the timing cover.
So I found some good news/bad news.
There was only one separator plate - not the matching pair. Interesting.
There's was TONS of sludge and crap behind that separator plate. I mean it was NASTY.
However, I discovered a good-sized hole worn through the timing cover. That's good news and bad. Good news is that perhaps my engine block is not cracked, but the bad news: I've now got a timing cover replacement job. That's a chore. Still easier than rebuilding the entire engine.
Wondering about just yanking the engine to just do main and rod bearings and perhaps the rear main seal. Freshen up some gaskets, paint it, then reinstall. Can deal with the timing cover while she's on the engine stand.
'68's didn't have the rubber seal/tubes, they just used the 2 divider plates. '69 and up used the rubber sleeves with the 11 bolt water pump. '68 was the eight bolt pump.
Looks like you are missing one of the plates for that application.
"Wondering about just yanking the engine to just do main and rod bearings and perhaps the rear main seal. Freshen up some gaskets, paint it, then reinstall. Can deal with the timing cover while she's on the engine stand.
Thoughts?"
I would never take a tight engine apart unless testing indicated that was necessary. You said compression was good so I would expect the rest is fine. I would think that hole developed when all that crud sat there and ate away at it. I doubt the engine was run with the hole otherwise all the coolant would have ended up in the oil pan. If there was still coolant when the hole developed it would have seeped inside the oil but you said it sat for 10 years so an oil change would have removed it. The timing cover is available new but is getting expensive, like everything else. If buying used watch for pitting and corrosion. FWIW I have never seen anything like that there. See Oly's thread he started out with a pretty bad situation but it cleaned up OK. Oly's 1968 convertible thread
68 is a one year only timing cover. 8 bolt water pump but the new design balancer. Might be hard to find. You can just go with the 69 and later cover and 11 bolt water pump and corresponding pulley
